[greekdude]

Hi,
I just finished replacing my old SD livewire/livewire metal set in my old Kramer 210 (which run at 18v and 100KOhm pots), with the EMG 85b/81n set. Originally I intended this to be the classic 81b/85n setup but as many ppl have experienced this does not balance well. I tested both with the stock 18v wiring as well as with bridging one of the clips (9V). here are my impressions, also with regards to another 81b/60n set that I have in my mahogany single-cut ARZ800 :
- I find the cleans of 85 in the bridge good. Better than livewire metal, for sure, but still nothing extraordinary. The 81 in the neck is somewhat darker than the livewire neck
- I kept the 9V mod, with 18V I didn't get the squealies I get with the 9V mod. Now it squeals easier almost all over the board, even in high E
- I concluded once again that wood/construction/scale is VERY important. The guitar surely sounds different than with the livewires but the basic character is unchanged. The natural harmonics that used to ring very loud with the livewires are still the same harmonics that want to ring loud with the EMGs. Next strings change I will try with swapping to 81b/85n or by replacing the 81/60 I have an the ARZ800. In short I feel that what I hear in the ARZ800 is not EMG sound but mahogany 25", 24 frets, fixed bridge sound, and in the Kramer not EMG sound but 80s super strat, 22 frets, floyd-rose sound.
- So when I dreamed of getting the cleans of 81/60 in the ARZ800 with the Kramer I was wrong. The cleans in neck are nice (livewire neck was nice as well but with more treble), bridge are good, mid works nice, but not mind blowing.
- 85 output-wise, destroys the 81. 85b/81n balances very good at the same height.
- 85 is very quiet. 81 not so much.
- Distorted sounds great in bridge and neck. Plenty of shredding tones. Nice riffs.

[greekdude]

update : I kept the 9V mod. Harmonics are poor with the 18V wiring.

[greekdude]

Just swapped to 81b/85n . Awful, the 81 in the bridge is weak, empty, hollow, humming at 50Hz noise, no meat at all, no thickness, 85 in the neck, is very loud but indifferent. It might be the guitar, which (is said to) have plywood body, 3-piece maple neck, rosewood fretboard, floyd rose ii. The difference in tone quality between this and the 85b/81n is chaotic. And I doubt smth went wrong with wiring cause I used the quick connect cables.
I don't know, is there smth I miss? Is it the particular guitar? How come and the whole world praises the 81b/85n but it does not work at all in this guitar? Also, in contrast, is it possible the swapped setup (85b/81n) to work so well? I know ppl had good experiences with 85 in the bridge and 81 in the neck but I could expect *such* a difference.

Also I came up with smth else. EMGs don't work well with F-spaced guitars. Plucking the high E up sounds good. Plucking down sounds very week unless I move the whole pup about 1-2 mm down, but then it is the low E that starts to suffer from the equivalent effect. I plan to plug and re-drill the pup ring holes about 1.5mm down.

[KH Guitar Freak]

Hmm. Shouldn't be humming. In fact, EMGs are very quiet pickups. Might be the wiring or pickup is having issues

[greekdude]

Hmm. Shouldn't be humming. In fact, EMGs are very quiet pickups. Might be the wiring or pickup is having issues

in my flat both EMG81 hum. Most of the ppl in my country also say the same. Must be the 220V mains EMI.

[greekdude]

early SD ad :

https://www.amazon.com/Seymour-Duncan-Blackouts-Humbucker-Pickups/dp/B00113HVPW

Have less hum than the competition
They also have more lows, more highs, and more output
Simply put, the Blackouts have more tone than other active pickups

so i guess this isn't only me

[KH Guitar Freak]

I wouldn't take their word as gospel. Anyway, I do own several guitars loaded with EMGs. I never had a hum issue myself. If it ever hummed with a certain setup, regular magnetic pickups would hum louder with the same rig setup

[DavidSchwab]

The 81 is a bridge pickup. It's wound hotter with 43 gauge wire. The 85 is a neck pickup. It's wound like a PAF. It was originally the 58, as in a 1958 PAF, but the 58 was a bit noisy so they replaced it with the 85. The 58 had mis matched coils, which is why it was noisy.

So you have them reversed. Thst's why the 81 is muddy at the neck.

And they should be dead quiet. I've never had any hum coming from EMG pickups.

Here's a tip; try using a higher value volume pot I find that 50k or 100k sounds better. I also agree the EMG guitar pickups sound better on 9volts. The bass pickups sound better at 18volts.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[jazzfromhell]

A little off topic but can I ask you about your impressions of the ARZ800? Im thinking of getting one for the studio just for meaty metal rhythm tracking. I can get a good deal on one and I'd rather buy Ibanez than Gibson. How do you like it?

[greekdude]

I wouldn't take their word as gospel. Anyway, I do own several guitars loaded with EMGs. I never had a hum issue myself. If it ever hummed with a certain setup, regular magnetic pickups would hum louder with the same rig setup

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/SEYMOUR-DUNCAN-ORIGINAL-BLACKOUTS-ACTIVE-HUMBUCKER-BLACK-NECK-AHB-1n-/370629566330?hash=item564b3e5f7a:m:mCbRzLtv95qRWh-km08Mmsw

Description

The "other" USA-made active humbuckers use unbalanced inputs in a differential preamp. The problem is, an unbalanced differential preamp is not very effective at cancelling hum.

This is not just taking anyone's word. This is SD's ad which is 100% aligned with my experience with both my 81s and my 60. 85 is noiseless indeed.
Both 81 and 60 have imbalanced coils. Also there is an article out there explaining this : http://www.electrosmash.com/emg81

The numbers show that the EMG design will not reject the hum as good as the classic balanced design. This will not make much difference if any to the noise cancelling efficiency, 14.8 dB of hum rejection is still a nice number.

in this specific room that I play both my 81s hum like a cow. 60 a little better. 85 even better. Blaze bridge is almost perfect. Blaze neck is 100% noiseless.

Now, which sound do I like clean the most? Mahogany arz800 with 81/60.

[greekdude]

The 81 is a bridge pickup. It's wound hotter with 43 gauge wire. The 85 is a neck pickup. It's wound like a PAF. It was originally the 58, as in a 1958 PAF, but the 58 was a bit noisy so they replaced it with the 85. The 58 had mis matched coils, which is why it was noisy.

So you have them reversed. Thst's why the 81 is muddy at the neck.

And they should be dead quiet. I've never had any hum coming from EMG pickups.

Here's a tip; try using a higher value volume pot I find that 50k or 100k sounds better. I also agree the EMG guitar pickups sound better on 9volts. The bass pickups sound better at 18volts.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

85/81 balances much better. 81 is way better in the neck than the 85. IMHO they should be sold like a 85b/81n set and not vice versa. Or even make a version of the 81 which does not hum.

[greekdude]

A little off topic but can I ask you about your impressions of the ARZ800? Im thinking of getting one for the studio just for meaty metal rhythm tracking. I can get a good deal on one and I'd rather buy Ibanez than Gibson. How do you like it?

man, arz800 gave me ALL I could expect from the single-cut all mahogany 25" scale guitar.

weight, ergonomics, tone, easiness, action, etc etc ALL are great.
Only minus is fretwork which is not bad but not perfect.
Also pay attention to any defects on bridge, tail piece.
This tight-tune bridge is a very good bridge.

[DavidSchwab]

85/81 balances much better. 81 is way better in the neck than the 85. IMHO they should be sold like a 85b/81n set and not vice versa. Or even make a version of the 81 which does not hum.

Not sure how it balances better since the 81 is louder.

Back when I used EMGs they were dead quiet.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[KH Guitar Freak]

In a H/H guitar, I quite like the 81/81 combo in three of my other guitars. However, I also do own an EBMM Luke BFR with 85/SLV/SLV, and a limited edition Luke True Gold with 85X/SLVX/SLVX, and also a Valley Arts guitar with 85/SAV/SAV. They are sound great. Again, never had any hums issues ever

[greekdude]

85/81 balances much better. 81 is way better in the neck than the 85. IMHO they should be sold like a 85b/81n set and not vice versa. Or even make a version of the 81 which does not hum.

Not sure how it balances better since the 81 is louder.

Back when I used EMGs they were dead quiet.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

lots of ppl online claim the same thing that I did : it is very hard to balance 81b/85n unless you raise the 81 to the top and bury 85 flush to the body. Search it if you wish.